Two...two....two Tele's in one!

[duhvoodooman]

I'd look into Warmoth. They offer a wide variety of made-to-order pickguards: http://www.warmoth.com/Pickguard/TelePickguard.aspx

 

[sunvalleylaw]

Ok, I am finally going to do the mod seeing as my tele is forcing me to take it apart anyway. The neck pickup in my tele stopped working. I have not taken it apart yet, so it may just be a loose wire, but as long as I am taking it apart and fixing things, I am going to put a quick connect system, and prepare a second PG with a BG P90 in it. DVM, I am betting not, but did you find any loss of signal or anything with the quick connect system?

Also, I am thinking I will just get the Duncan quick connect system, unless it is way more expensive than getting the parts. Any thoughts there?

 

[sunvalleylaw]

PS, DVM, did you ever measure how hot the pickups were in the CV or the CVC? I know the CVC has Alnico V magnets. Not sure how hot they are though.

 

[duhvoodooman]

DVM, I am betting not, but did you find any loss of signal or anything with the quick connect system?

None evident.

Also, I am thinking I will just get the Duncan quick connect system, unless it is way more expensive than getting the parts. Any thoughts there?

What Duncan product are you referring to?

PS, DVM, did you ever measure how hot the pickups were in the CV or the CVC? I know the CVC has Alnico V magnets. Not sure how hot they are though.

They're pretty much vintage voiced in both guitars. The only stock pickup left in either of my CV Teles is the neck in the CVC, which is 6.5K. Pretty sure the bridge is comparable, but I replaced it with a used Fender CS Broadcaster so I can't check it for you.

 

[sunvalleylaw]

I meant the Duncan Liberator that you linked earlier in the thread after they "stole" your idea.

http://www.premierguitar.com/Magazi...iberator_Solderless_Pickup_Change_System.aspx They go for $24.95 on Amazon for both the 250 and 500 type pots.

I bet knowing they are vintage type is good enough. I could try measuring for myself. I don't remember if I have a meter though. I will have to search the garage. Man I am lazy sometimes.

 

[duhvoodooman]

Yeah, I looked on the Duncan website and it all came flooding back...

Certainly seems like a $25 time-saver. But I don't see any of the Duncan wiring diagrams for it that show how to hook it up with a Tele-style 3-way switch. Everything seems to be based upon Les Paul type wiring. But you may be able to find something on the web....or figure it out yourself. Shouldn't be too hard.

 

[sunvalleylaw]

I looked at them and noticed that they come in the 250k and 500k pot variety. I am installing another single coil, but might like the option of putting in a Gretsch type humbucker later. I was reading how you balanced out the electronics to split the difference between your mini-humbucker and the bridge single coil. I will have to do some research to figure out the best way to do that. Or follow your way, and stay with the 250k pot until I decide I want to try some sort of humbucker.

 

[Duffy]

They say the Seymour Duncan "Pearly Gates" full size humbucker is designed to work well with 250k pots but can also be used with 500k pots. I'm not sure how that can be, but evidently this is the case.

I think Fender has been known to use 333k pots on some of their telecasters with the full humbucker at the neck and the traditional tele pickup single coil bridge. This sort of splits the difference and might make sense. It might sound good, but not exactly like either type guitar, which could be a good thing.

Going 500k would make the humbucker sound right and would brighten the single coil, which also might not be a bad idea. Some of those single coil guitars have historically used 1meg pots, if I'm not mistaken. I'm not sure if that would be ice pick city or if you could tame it with the tone knob, but that might work too.

I called Fender technical service and they looked at the wiring diagram for one of their big dollar telecasters with the full humbucker in the neck and told me how they do it so both pickups sound right. I think that is when they told me about the 333k pots.

It looks like a challenge but there are a lot great guitars set up that way, so there must be good ways of wiring them up. I would want to do it so the full humbucker sounds good, and not muddy or bass boomy with 250k pots. I don't think that would be enjoyable.

 

[sunvalleylaw]

Thanks Duffy. Remember, I will be initially installing a P90, and just wanted to leave open the possibility of a quickconnect pickguard with a Gretsch type/Filtertron type humbucker in it. The Duncan Liberator comes in either a 250k or 500k model. Hmm.

If after looking at it, I go with a Liberator rather than follow what DVM did, I will start a new thread so I don't dirty up his thread any more.

 

[Duffy]

The P 90 sounds like it will be an awesome guitar, and you will not have to change the pot values, just wire it in with the quick connects or whatever you choose.

Your plan for the P 90 sounds awesome and I will definitely be looking forward to reading about it and seeing the pictures.

 

[duhvoodooman]

Thanks Duffy. Remember, I will be initially installing a P90, and just wanted to leave open the possibility of a quickconnect pickguard with a Gretsch type/Filtertron type humbucker in it. The Duncan Liberator comes in either a 250k or 500k model. Hmm.

If after looking at it, I go with a Liberator rather than follow what DVM did, I will start a new thread so I don't dirty up his thread any more.

A couple of considerations for you, Steve:

1) I poked around some on the web and didn't find any guidance on how to wire in the Liberator for a Telecaster. Having looked at the unit, I've got a pretty good idea how to do it. But I'm not buying a Liberator, and maybe you are....

2) Hopefully you realize this, but the Liberator is not a totally solderless system--it's solderless for the pickup wire connections. You'll still need to solder the Liberator to the 3-way pickup selector switch. So you don't get totally off the solder iron hook, FWIW....

3) The Liberator is a fairly beefy unit due to the depth of the unit and the width of that 10-screw connector strip. Maker sure that it will fit into the Tele's control cavity! Maybe Duncan lists the dimensions somewhere?

While poking around on the interwebs looking at solderless pickup connector systems, I came across THIS BAD BOY. Considerably more expensive, but truly solderless and unbelievably flexible, even having auto-switching between 250K and 500K pot resistance depending on which pickup is selected. Major droolage ensued....

 

[sunvalleylaw]

Well THAT is cool! Since I do not have a second pickup in mind at this point, I was just going to solder the new one in as at least that much was going to be required for the Duncan unit. If after playing the guitar with the new pickup I think I want it to be swappable, then I think I would step up to this new on you found. Good Find, Mr. Mad Guitar Scientist!

 

[duhvoodooman]

I think I'm going to pick one of those up, not because it's solderless (I'm pretty comfortable with soldering! ), but because of all the other switchable capabilities it has. Modern or 50's style volume pot connection, treble bleed, auto-vol. pot resistance switching, 3- or 4-way pickup selector switch capability, 9 different selectable tone cap values. Wowzah!! :drool :socool

EDIT: One obstacle to overcome--the CV Tele's have a raised section of wood in the middle of the control cavity that interferes with the Elek-Trix module and has to be removed for it to fit:

"As long as your control cavity is 1.00" wide, 1.50" deep and is flat on the bottom then it will fit with no problems. If your control cavity has a raised section in the center like some newer Tele models then you will need to remove it."

Since the CV body is pine and very soft, it should be pretty easy to remove with a chisel.

 

[sunvalleylaw]

That seems pretty tempting. I would have to remove a bit of alder on mine.

 

[sunvalleylaw]

So can you update us on how the install of that wiring kit went? It looks pretty slick!

 

[duhvoodooman]

It's pretty straightforward, and truly solderless. I started by clipping all the wires off the original control plate assembly right above their solder connections. (I bought my Santellan Elek-Trix with a control plate--an extra $10--so that now I have a complete spare Tele control assembly to save as a back-up or sell if I decide I don't need it.) Next, I slid the Santellan unit into the Tele control cavity to see how it fit. It turned out that because of the layout of the Santellan module's components (high at the 4-way switch and the wire connector block but lower in between them), it was not necessary to completely remove the raised center section of the control cavity. The module only interfered with the center "hump" at the tone control end, so I was able to grind out as much as I needed (about 1/4 - 3/8") to remove using a 1/2" sanding drum on my Dremel tool. Here's what the Santellan unit looks like--the nice diamond-knurl knobs and output jack are included with it:

After that, it was just a matter of stripping about 1/4" of insulation off the wire ends, spiral-twisting the strands together and inserting them into the correct connector slot on the Santellan module. Their excellent detailed installation diagram made this a breeze. You just depress the small tab on top with the blade of a small screwdriver, slide the wire end into the slot, and release the tab. The internal connection mechanism grabs the wire end and holds it quite securely. There's also a grounding block with a set screw on the tone control part of the module, so you can connect any additional ground wires that you don't have a place for on the connector block. I hooked up the ground wire for the bridge plate there. The slider switches to set the various feature options and tone control capacitance can then be set as desired with the tip of a small flat-blade screwdriver.

Probably the toughest part of the installation for me was routing the excess pickup wire around in the control cavity so that it's tucked out of the way, because I don't like to trim the pickup wires short--might need the extra length in the future. The Santellan unit is pretty bulky, so getting the excess wire tucked into where it wouldn't interfere with anything took a bit of finagling. Not a big deal, though.

 

[sunvalleylaw]

Cool! Thanks for the report. That is what I will use in my project. I am not sure that I really need the 4th position, but for an extra $10, it is worth trying out.

 

[duhvoodooman]

I am not sure that I really need the 4th position, but for an extra $10, it is worth trying out.

Oh, you don't need it, but once you hear it, you'll be glad you have it!

 

[Tig]

I can see one of those in my future. :AOK

 

[Duffy]

A couple of considerations for you, Steve:

even having auto-switching between 250K and 500K pot resistance depending on which pickup is selected. Major droolage ensued....

I know this was a concern. This unit sounds great. It will be interesting to see how it works out.

I checked the wiring diagrams on fenders web page and notice that my '72 Custom reissue telecaster, with the full size wide range humbucker at the neck, as well as my Lonestar strat with the SD Pearly Gates bridge pickup, both have "only" 250k pots. So this indicates that you can use 250k pots in guitars that mix single coils and full sized humbuckers, and use them effectively with great sound.

I realize that at this time you are installing a P90 in your CVC and have that awesome control assembly. I just thought I'd mention this because I, for one, have been wondering what pot or pots they put in those guitars that mix the single coils with the full sized humbuckers; like the tele's with the neck humbuckers, and the hss strats. I have also read that some people switch the pots to 500k in these guitars. Mine are staying like they are.

I hope this information helps anyone that is thinking of putting a full sized humbucker in the neck of their tele or bridge of their strat.

 

[sunvalleylaw]

Thanks Duffy. That is the cool thing about this Santellan sounds unit, because you can easily swap pickups, and also mix and match pot values to see what works best.

 

[Duffy]

Thanks Duffy. That is the cool thing about this Santellan sounds unit, because you can easily swap pickups, and also mix and match pot values to see what works best.

I see that. That looks like a useful item.

One of my favorite guitar styles for just overall vibe and playing is a telecaster with a full sized humbucker at the neck and a really nice single coil telecaster bridge pickup. Although some complain about the wide range HB at the neck of the Fender '72 Custom reissue telecaster, I totally appreciate the tone of the WRHB, plus it has a really nice Fender tele bridge pickup. I also have a Peavey Generation EXP tele with a full sized regular covered HB at the neck and a surprisingly nice bridge tele pickup - this Peavey guitar feels great and has a really great vibe to it with a beautiful antique burst and maple fretboard. It just feels and plays great in addition to its remarkable sound.

I think a P90 at the neck of your CVC is going to bring that guitar into some uncharted territory to explore. I suppose it will sound a lot different from the stock guitar and that the P90 will be very useful. That black pickguard also is going to look very cool. I might have to put a RWRP P90 at the neck of one of my tele's, but definitely not one of the ones with the humbucker neck pickups - they are not going anywhere.

Man, I bet you are anxious to start putting that project together; and even more anxious to start playing it and chasing its mojo. The Classic 30 is a cool amp and should keep you happy with that. Lately I have been playing guitars at a local store exclusively thru a nice Fender Blues Jr III, black stock one, and it has a really beautiful clean sound that overdrives easily as you turn it up, without flushing the management off their roosts. That is a very nice, so called, little amp.