Cheap Tele for customisation - suggestions please!

[Sada Yairi]

My collection (a classical, a Dot and a Wildkat) is lacking a hardbody. I've actually never owned one and I'm thinking it's about time that changed. Whilst looking around before I bought the Wildkat recently I tried a lot of different guitars including solidbodies so I have learned a bit recently about what I like and what I don't like. At this stage I'm thinking that I'd like to get myself a cheap Tele body and customise it. My Wildkat (with its beautiful P90s) is my number 1, but I'm thinking it would be fun to have a cheap Tele that I can play around with, modify etc. What would you lot recommend? I'd like something that's decently built, but cheap. The electronics can be lousy because I'll swap them out, it's really the body I'm after. Ideally I'd like the guitar to have no brand name on it cos I'd like it to be just my own personalised little baby. I've had a look at Rondos (very cheap) and even some cheap no-names on ebay like this one:

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI...sspagename=STRK:MEWAX:IT&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc

The only requirement will be that I want to run twin humbuckers, and ideally I'd like a higher radius neck (maybe even 12"). Any thoughts?

 

[Duffy]

My personal opinion, when hot rodding or modifying a guitar, it yields the best results when you start with a real good guitar to begin with. For instance, I have been thinking of buying a good used MIM tele for around 200 plus and hot rodding that. These have real good bodies and nice necks already, and some of the other parts can be used, like possibly the bridge and some of the electronics. The pickups are really cheap junk in my opinion - I bought a new MIM and could hardly stand to play the noisy thing, and it didn't have good tone. I replaced the pickups with Seymour Duncan Alnico II Pro's and it is one of my favorite guitars now

I think the neck on the MIM teles is real good, it has a very thin finish, almost like oil, where your thumb rests; unlike many teles, like the excellent CV's that have a heavy handed application of thick polyurethane on them - still a great tele though. Modifying a Classic Vibe tele might be a great idea. They are really nice guitars to begin with.

Some of the single coil sized humbuckers are really good and you can install them right into the stock openings with no problem, and they produce great noiseless sound. Some companies make inexpensive noiseless humbucking single coil tele pickups.

If you want a twin full sized humbucker tele Fender makes the Black Top Tele that is a fairly awesome guitar to begin with. It has half way decent humbuckers and is a fairly well built guitar totally ready for modification - new awesome pickups, tuners, etc. The cost about 450 new - when you consider that you will be buying a cheap guitar and buying all the modification parts, you are going to be close to that cost or over it easily, and the Black Top is a very decent guitar to begin with.

Based on personal experience, I recommend starting with a very decent guitar to begin with and then building it up. I have been way more happy going this route than starting with low end stuff and putting a lot of money into it. I wind up with a higher quality guitar in the end, which is what I personally plan to do when modifying guitars in the future.

I'd say shop around for used and try to find something really decent. I see Fender teles for as low as 200. I think the Rondo teles have messed up looking headstocks that destroy the tele vibe, same with a lot of other cheap tele copies. A new decent neck can cost you a lot of money from Warmoth or where ever. Plus I like to have a nice neck and body already fitted very nicely with low action.

The things I look for are very personalized from doing modifications in the past. It's fun to do modifications and you can come up with a cool guitar in the end. My most recent approach is to find a real good guitar to beging with and then build that up to an awesome guitar. That seems to make the process way more rewarding and exciting. You can find real decent used guitars out there that are around the same price you'd pay for a cheap GFS type thing or Rondo thing. To me it just makes sense to hunt down a decent used guitar and go from there.

To each their own, needless to say. If you want to buy a real inexpensive guitar and mess around with it, that's cool. Obviously it's your money and you can do whatever you want. You will learn a lot in the process, for sure. That might be what satisfies you in the end. I would just say, search around and start with a real good guitar to beging with - not necessarily an expensive one, but a real good one.

I hope this helps you think this out. I'm just sharing with you some of my own experiences in hot rodding guitars, based on mistakes I have made myself and the new approach I have that is probably no more expensive than my earlier projects using quite low end guitars . If any the difference in cost has been negligible.

 

[markb]

As Duffy says, you need to start with something good. There's that old adage about the thing that can't be polished after all. And don't forget that whatever you do to upgrade a cheap guitar it still retains its basic cheapness if you come to sell it on. Just because you take a $100 tele and spend $500 in parts doesn't make it worth $600 if you choose to sell it on, it's still a $100 guitar and you will never recoup the cost of your upgrades.

Having said that, the Rondo SX teles get a lot of love over at tdpri.com. Squier Standards can often be had quite cheap and are good solid platforms but the cheapest popular mod platform of all is the butterscotch blonde Squier Affinity. I'd beware of distance buying with cheaper instruments, the quality can vary wildly. Try before you buy is best by far.

I'd do some reading at tdpri.com for suggestions. There are a lot (and I mean a lot!) of threads there about modding/upgrading cheap teles.

 

[Eric]

Off the top of my head as some places to look:

Jay Turser
SX
Saga Gladiator
Xaviere
Squier Affinity

But yeah, just make sure you don't want to ever sell it if you're going to mod a cheapie. That said, it seems like it could be a fun project, so keep us apprised of your progress.

 

[Commodore 64]

As Duffy says, you need to start with something good. There's that old adage about the thing that can't be polished after all.

I completely disagree with this. In fact I strenuously disagree with this. I've fixed up numerous <$150 Samicks, Squiers, Johnson, Fullerton, Turser, even a Behringer. With a good fret leveling, nut, and possible shim, I can make these guitars play great. Each and every one of them. The key is to find a neck profile you like because unless you wanna carve your own profile, you are stuck with what you got. Everything else is just hardware. Hardware that can easily be swapped out as needed or as budget allows. And as far as pickups go, a load of hype. A pure, unaldulterated, utter load of hype. The amp makes 100x more difference in tone than anything on the guitar. The only thing you need a guitar to do is play well.

I'm a habitual pick-up swapper. I know that seems to be a paradox giving my above statement. But I like to tinker. And it does give my opinion on this matter some degree of substance. I've used a LOT of different pickups. Active vs passive, yes there's a noticeable difference. Magnet types? I'm not really convinced that the magnet type matters more than the number of windings or what you do with the signal at the amp. The best sounding strat PUPs I ever had (IMHO, and a couple other long time musicians I know) were stock cermaics from '94 MiM Squier Series.

I also love to get the cheapest, beat to hell guitars and make them play great. The only ones I haven't been able to get the way I want them are:

1. The one I built myself from scratch. The truss rod won't adjust properly and the frets are ground to hell and back. But that's because I also built the truss rod from scratch and didn't cut my fret slots deep enough.
2. An old Harmony guitar from the 70s. It's just an utter dog. But I still feel like the failure there is mine, and the bridge. The bridge is not adjustable for height or intonation.

Fact is, any guitar that comes off an assembly line has the baseline quality you need to make it play great. Go to your local Samick dealer (if you can find one). You can get a brand spanking new Samick tele for like $100. If you don't mod it, it will have a LIFETIME warranty. Try out some AXLs (if you can find them). Try out the cheapest beat up affinties hanging at Guitar Center. You can ALWAYS get them to knock 25-30 bucks off of those beaters because everybody and their brother has played the crap out of them. And guess what. They are GREAT guitars once you put a fret leveling and set-up on them. Even the cheapo bridges and tuners stay in tune these days (unlike those on that Harmony).

Even the Behringer. Even the Behringer plays great.

Just because you take a $100 tele and spend $500 in parts doesn't make it worth $600 if you choose to sell it on, it's still a $100 guitar and you will never recoup the cost of your upgrades.

On this, however, I agree wholeheartedly.

 

[FrankenFretter]

The stuff on Rondo is pretty good, especially the Agile brand, although that's getting into a bit pricier guitar. A lot of folks love the Douglas Teles, and the SX Teles seem to be a decent buy. I've heard that the SX Teles have a beefier neck than the Douglas versions. There are some Douglas models that are already packing dual hums, so you wouldn't have to do any routing. You could also get a Squier Custom, which has dual humbuckers and a tone/volume setup similar to a Les Paul. They're under $250 and built well (I have the Custom II, which has dual P90s).

 

[Commodore 64]

The Custom and Custom II Squiers also have a nice chunky neck profile that I've been unable to find on other guitars. So if that intrigues you, deffo check those out. There's one on my local CL right now for $100.

http://akroncanton.craigslist.org/msg/3017202583.html

 

[sunvalleylaw]

I want to do a tele project sometime, and I think I would start with a CV or a Custom Squire. Specifically, I would like a thinline. The necks and the bodies coming on the Cvs and customs these days seem worth it as a starting point. Plus you can buy those direct from the store and know what you are getting. Ordering one of the online ones might work out fine, but I prefer to know what I am getting up front. The smallish difference in price is worth it to me not to have to mess with it if something is not right.

I have also heard the Xaviere tele necks are a bit bat like, and I prefer the Squire necks.

 

[sunvalleylaw]

Even a new CV (and I bet you could find a decent one used) would be way less than getting the parts pulled together from one of the parts retailers I bet.

 

[Katastrophe]

I second FrankenFretter on this one...

You could also look into building your own partscaster tele, using aftermarket parts. You could then build a Tele style guitar to your specs, pick colors, pickups and all the other parts to your liking.

The downside to modding any guitar is that you will never get the money out of it that you put into it if you decide to ever sell it.

 

[Duffy]

I agree with you FF'r. That Squier Custom Tele is cool. I have the twin P90 one like you and it's definitely nice. I've oftentimes thought about buying one of those Customs with the twin humbuckers; I'm sure that they are really decent guitars for the money - and they don't have the dopey looking headstock found on most tele copies. At least I think they are dopey looking - to each their own. I also totally agree with SVL as far as a relatively inexpensive tele by going with a CV, but you can get a used Fender for the cost of a CV, a MIM anyway - and you are going to upgrade those junk pickups that come stock if you get one.

I also see what you are saying 64. It is all about what satisfies "you" in the long run. I'm sure you are very satisfied with a lot of the ones you have put together. I used to fix up old low end guitars, but now I'm much more satisfied hot rodding decent used Fenders and things like that. I'm more satisfied with the outcome that I get. My MIM tele with the Seymour Duncan Alnico II Pro's is really satisfying to me. It was not too expensive over the long run and now it is something I "like" and enjoy. I could have bought a Fender "Baja" tele.

Then there are some that are never satisfied.

 

[markb]

I completely disagree with this. In fact I strenuously disagree with this. I've fixed up numerous <$150 Samicks, Squiers, Johnson, Fullerton, Turser, even a Behringer. With a good fret leveling, nut, and possible shim, I can make these guitars play great. Each and every one of them. The key is to find a neck profile you like because unless you wanna carve your own profile, you are stuck with what you got. Everything else is just hardware. Hardware that can easily be swapped out as needed or as budget allows. And as far as pickups go, a load of hype. A pure, unaldulterated, utter load of hype. The amp makes 100x more difference in tone than anything on the guitar. The only thing you need a guitar to do is play well. ...

Well said. I think my point was that I've had quite a few "cheap" guitars but they were bought because they were actually rather good to start with and not as a platform for many hours of work to bring them up to as "good" as a more expensive instrument. Any guitar that plays well and sounds reasonable out of the box is a good guitar. Plug it into a good amp and it will sound better, no question.

Anyway, I have this arrangement with anything that needs cutting or filing, I don't touch it and it doesn't end up as a horrible mess

 

[FrankenFretter]

The Custom and Custom II Squiers also have a nice chunky neck profile that I've been unable to find on other guitars. So if that intrigues you, deffo check those out. There's one on my local CL right now for $100.

http://akroncanton.craigslist.org/msg/3017202583.html

Must have sold it, the listing is gone. That's a steal for these. Even retail is a steal, really. The frets may need some filing on the ends (mine had sharp ends on every one of them), but the neck has either a satin finish, or no finish at all (it feels like it's unfinished to me). I prefer my necks that way. I don't really find the neck to be chunky, but maybe that's just me.

Btw, I have a dual-hum pickguard for that I bought for the Custom II, but I won't be needing it since I love the P90s. If you are interested, (or anyone else, really), let me know. I'd part with it for a reasonable price.

Good luck on your search. And one can never have too many Teles, so if you end up buying several, don't feel too guilty!

 

[NWBasser]

And one can never have too many Teles, so if I end up buying several, I don't feel too guilty!

oke

 

[FrankenFretter]

oke

Funny.

Actually, this is what I'm gassing for at the moment:

 

[Tig]

You could also get a Squier Custom, which has dual humbuckers and a tone/volume setup similar to a Les Paul. They're under $250 and built well (I have the Custom II, which has dual P90s).

I bought this exact same guitar from a pawn shop for $50 because it had loose hardware and showed surface usage. It had a pair of Seymour Duncans, too! There are some great used deals out there.

 

[markb]

The stuff on Rondo is pretty good, especially the Agile brand, although that's getting into a bit pricier guitar. A lot of folks love the Douglas Teles, and the SX Teles seem to be a decent buy. I've heard that the SX Teles have a beefier neck than the Douglas versions. There are some Douglas models that are already packing dual hums, so you wouldn't have to do any routing. You could also get a Squier Custom, which has dual humbuckers and a tone/volume setup similar to a Les Paul. They're under $250 and built well (I have the Custom II, which has dual P90s).

Those are nice. Surely should be called a Deluxe and not a Custom though but then Jaguars shouldn't have two HBs either (are you listening, Fender? Huh, huh?? I'm a pedant and I'm angry!!!)

My fave 2HB tele' and one I'd track down if I hadn't bought a LP Studio is the Squier Master Series Mahogany Chambered. Set neck, 4 knobs, mahogany, even a bound top. Basically a Lescaster Link to a user page.

 

[Sada Yairi]

Shipping is the killer. The Xaviere range (Guitarfetish.com) and the Rondo range are the frontrunners - even with shipping they come in around $200 to $300 which isn't bad. But I find myself thinking that the Fender Modern Player Teles aren't bad, and at $580 in Aus it's not a big leap for a guitar that is probably significantly better to begin with.

 

[Duffy]

Very true. Those Modern Player Fenders are cool, especially the tele I checked out. I think they are in another ball park from Xavier and even Rondo products, in general. I mean there are a lot of real nice Rondo products, but none of the Xaviers seem that good. I have an Xavier LP copy and I don't think it compares to my other guitars. An Agile would be far better and with shipping it would probably cost as much as a Fender. The Fender Black Top tele is a really nice dual full sized humbucker guitar, but I wouldn't have any idea how much one would cost in you part of the World.

Good luck. Looks like you are well into the decision making process.

 

[Sada Yairi]

In Aus I can get a Modern Player Tele for $585 or a Blacktop Tele for $654 (although average price for both is more like $750-800). I can get a Standard Tele for $690. The Modern Player Tele is HSS which is completely different to anything I currently have, so that's appealing. Problem is that if I'm spending in the region of $600 then it becomes a guitar that I care about and won't want to mod. If I spend $200 (shipped) for an SX or Rondo then I won't care about it and won't mimd mucking around with it (the Agile isn't worth it when you include shipping - might as well buy a Fender). I'm very much in two minds. I have a Wildkat that I love and given that in Aus they cost around $800 I wouldn't dare modifiy it at all. On the other hand I have an old Dot that I've had for years, and I've enjoyed doing some re-finishing work etc on it, knowing that it's not really worth anything financially so even if I botch it up it won't matter.

I haven't played the Modern Player yet, so that'll be worth doing. And the SX and Rondo will be a significant gamble cos I can't play one before ordering it. Psychologically that actually helps cos I have to be prepared for the $200 or so to be a complete loss given that I'd be ordering it blind. If it's already a complete loss, then whatever does get delivered is already a bonus!

 

[Duffy]

If you bought the Modern Player with the full humbucker bridge, strat middle, and tele neck, which is a cool guitar I think, you could over time replace the pickups with really good ones. Such as, I just put a Dimarzio Super Distortion nickel covered humbucker in the bridge of my Epi LP Standard plus top and it transformed the sound of that guitar a lot. It just really sounds great and overdriven easily thru a good tube amp.

My Fender MIM tele standard came with real junk pickups - noisy and without excellent tele tone. I salvaged it by putting in Seymour Duncan real nice Alnico II Pro tele pickups that give it a classic sound - what a difference. These guitars are really enjoyable to play because they feel and sound so good.

I also have a Fender Nashville Tele that has Tex Mex pickups; tele neck and bridge pickups and a strat pickup in the middle. It is a really cool guitar, stock, in my opinion. The Modern Player tele with the HSS pickups sounds like it would also be super cool, with a lot of great tonal options, and any improvements would only make it better, over time.

That's what I mean about starting with something really nice and then building it up where you want to in order to make it super awesome to play.

I wouldn't hesitate to try to find something real nice used either. Sometimes you can find some incredible deals. I just missed getting a mint MIM tele with a Seymour Duncan Hot Rail in the bridge for 200, but I decided to wait until morning to go get it and the dude backed out of the deal. I was not happy about that. Sometimes you have to be ready to move fast when you are looking for deals.

Good luck.

 

[Sada Yairi]

Yeah, I reckon the various combinations of an HSS setup would make for some interesting tones, and importantly, quite different to what I already have (Epi humbuckers and P90s). I've been looking around at used Fenders but in Aus they aren't cheap. On ebay at the moment the cheapest one is a 1994 MIM Tele for $350. It looks to be in not great condition, plus it's about 500 miles away and pickup only. Next cheapest is a modified MIM Standard at $450 incl freight, but it's also that distance away and I'd want to check it before I buy it. I think new is gonna be the only realistic option, partuclarly given that the Modern Player is $585 and available within 15mins of home.

It's true what you say about starting with quality. I'm not worried about resale value because I hang on to my guitars - I currently have 3 and have never sold one. It's more a matter of having something that I can have a relationship with in the long term. Each of my guitars (an SY classical, a Dot and the Wildkat) has taken a lot of checking and trying and research before buying and I've been very pleased with all three. That Fender would (I assume) have a nice body and neck and then I have the options with 3 pickups to do what I like down the track. Hmmmm...

 

[Sada Yairi]

On another forum someone suggested a Harley Benton - ever heard of them? I'd never heard of the brand (which seems to be an in-house tag for Chinese made guitars). This '52 style Tele looks a treat:

http://www.thomann.de/gb/harley_benton_hbt1952.htm

Does anyone have any experience with these guitars? This Tele would cost me $200 incl shipping to Australia which is incredibly cheap. I love the look of the body, but then the pictures on the company's own website will always look amazing. Seems it might be a good platform to work with though. Any thoughts?

 

[FrankenFretter]

On another forum someone suggested a Harley Benton - ever heard of them? I'd never heard of the brand (which seems to be an in-house tag for Chinese made guitars). This '52 style Tele looks a treat:

http://www.thomann.de/gb/harley_benton_hbt1952.htm

Does anyone have any experience with these guitars? This Tele would cost me $200 incl shipping to Australia which is incredibly cheap. I love the look of the body, but then the pictures on the company's own website will always look amazing. Seems it might be a good platform to work with though. Any thoughts?

A Tele is probably one of the hardest guitars to mess up. It's dead simple. As long as the neck is decent, I think almost any company can put out a fairly good Tele-ish guitar. I have one made for White Bridge Music, a music store on the East Coast of the US that went under a couple years ago. Chinese made, nice neck, decent pickups, and it was very inexpensive. If the company you're buying from has a good return policy, I say go ahead and dive in. Good luck!