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Tone2TheBone

Tone2TheBone

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During lunch today I picked up a set of 3 JJ Electronic ECC83 S's to replace my stock Chinese tubes in the Classic. DANG I love buying stuff! I'm hoping that the new JJs will provide even more sensational sonic bliss for me as I know some of you have been accustomed to already. I have one matched set of JJ's EL84s already so next week I will get the other 2 tubes to complete the transition. I've read a few posts in the history about those of you who have experience with the JJs. Anyone care to input further since those older posts?
 
Well, the first thing I noted when I dropped in the J & J tubes into my Peavey was that the amp was instantly more musical - as in overall tone and note definition. The cleans also took on more of a "chime", even with the slightest bit of reverb. Any Telecaster / Stratocaster you run though this amp will sound like a million bucks.

Tone, you've mentioned that the amp had a "darker" sound to it, or at least from what you've played of it so far. I noticed this more so when I had Groove Tubes in my amp (before the J & J's), and wasn't nearly as happy with them. I would also tend to equate this to some degree to using a humbucker-equipped guitar, and IMHO, is not as noticeable with Fenders. But since the J & J's have been in, I've felt that these "darker" tones have a sharper bite to them - less muddy, more open. Same thing with the mids. Where I've really noticed the difference in these timbres is that I don't need to use as much pre-amp gain to get that slightly over-driven, creamy mid-range crunch (the calling card of my "own tone"). Think of a less raspy version of La Grange.

Anyway, the J & J's I have found to be both extremely versatile, and very well-balanced. You won't have huge gaps between the low / mid / high frequencies, and from there, depending on your guitar, and your own personal tastes, you can pretty much dial in anything. Further, you will also find that these tubes have a very nice "touch" to them - as in you can really create some nice textural stuff (try your "boost" switch on the bridge p'up - you'll know what I mean!), whereas the stock tubes seemed just a little on the bland side.

I think you'll be really happy with J & J's - I know I am. So now that the tube question has been answered, I'm wondering what should we should have you get for a speaker . . . ? ;)
 
I think I told you Nel that I might try pulling one of the Vintage 30s out of the Jubilee to try out in the Classic. If I like then I'll order one. The Celestion V 30s seem to make great combo speakers. The more I REALLY play the amp the more I'm getting into the Devil's details. Initially I was very pleased with the amp in stock mode but as you yourself know...it's easy to get into the area of wanting to make things just a little bit better once you start paying attention to what you're hearing.

I had good luck with the GTs I got for my Marshall awhile back which really made the amp come alive. Of course I hadn't changed out my tubes since I got the amp brand new in '87 either. No telling how old this Classic is but I'm pretty dang sure those Chinese tubes were stock. I KNOW I can only make things better by tweaking it here and there and really for me thats the most fun thing of being a musician besides playing.....getting to mess with your stuff!
 
I pulled one of my Vintage 30s from my Marshall combo out to try in the Classic just to see. It was late last night when I did this so I couldn't open her up to really hear it. At low volumes the Vintage 30 (already almost 20 years old mind you) seemed to lack lower midrange than the existing Blue Marvel speaker. It had lows coming out but slightly lacked low midrange oomph. Of course like I said it was late and I only had the amp up to like 2 on the amp on both channels. You can't get a real sense of sound low like that. I'll try again today AND I will have installed the remaining power tubes I explained about in my other post.
 
My Peavey Delta Blues, which uses the same three 12AX7/ECC83 preamp tubes/ four EL84 power tube arrangement as the Classic 30, came with Sovtek (Russian) tubes as stock. (Actually, the preamp tubes are branded "Electro Harmonix", but I understand they are made in the Sovtek factory). I found them a little dark/dull also, and the lead channel sounded a bit harsh with the gain up past 8 or so. I replaced them with the "blues" version of the JJ retube kit for this amp model, which substitutes a lower gain preamp tube on the gain side of the lead channel. This reduces the volume but also smooths the character of the overdrive some. Overall, I found that the JJ retubing had exactly the effect that Nelskie describes--smoother, clearer and more musical in character. Definitely an improvement. I've since fooled around with a couple of NOS tubes for the V1 and V2 positions, and they give a bit more clarity and chime, but the difference is quite subtle. The original change from the stock Sovteks to the JJ's was more dramatic.

Not sure why you would hear less volume with the partial tube change you made. The most obvious cause would be that one or more of your new tubes is "cooler" than your stock tubes, i.e. has a lower gain factor. But it might also be related to not having matched EL84's in the power stage, I suppose. Will be interested to hear how the amp sounds once you have all JJ's in there. For what it's worth, they recommend that all 4 of the power tubes be "matched" for their output characteristics when you buy them, but my guess is that, as long as they're all the same brand, they should be pretty close.

A comment on Groove Tubes--it's my understanding that they don't actually produce any of their tubes. They source the tubes from various factories (almost all Chinese, I understand) and then grade them and affix their own brand name. Apparently, this leads to more consistency (modern tube production is extremely variable, from what I've read, so there's a lot of "fall-out" from the grading process), but doesn't mean that the overall quality is necessarily any better. I've read there are some excellent GT tubes (like their 12AX7-M "Mullard Reissue" model that Nelskie and I have both had good luck with) and some pretty mediocre ones. Not surprisingly, many of the GT tube types tend to cost a bit more than competitive brands due to their testing/grading process.
 
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DVM - I have one of the GT Mullard 12AX7s in my Marshall in the V1 position and man did it make a difference in the tone output. Very clear sound with lots of lower, mid and high frequency tones.

Well I went and picked up another set of power tubes for the Classic. Of course I am using 2 different sets of power tubes so the rating is slightly off from the original lot, but once I put these new ones in they sounded GREAT! I was off by 2 ratings on the matchup and the tech that sold them to me said it should be ok and the difference would not be noticed. He's right.

What's it sound like now? It sounds like totally new amph! Tight sound and velvety smooth frequency response all around. The overdrive in channel 2 is niiiice. There was a good increase in treble response so I'm happy. The Classic is complete with a new set of JJs all around!

As far as the Vintage 30 speaker test I ended up putting it back in my Jubilee. I played the amp for over an hour straight this afternoon with it in and while it sounded "ok" I personally thought the Blue Marvel complimented the amp better. New tubes and stock speaker....and I'm digging it. I may be the odd man out on the speaker choice but I think it's all relative due to so many factors. Location, humidity, numbers of beers we each drink etc. ;)
 
DVM - Yup. Overall volume is back and lovely as ever. These new tubes sure are nice. I'm going back and forth between the Bad Monkey in the clean channel and the amp's overdrive channel just by itself. Similar in sound. Similar attack. I even put back the retainer clips on the tubes. Loud volumes do not vibrate any of the tubes anymore and I am just loving this puppy.
 
tone2thebone said:
I am just loving this puppy.
Click to expand...
I'm wondering, would that officially classify it as puppy love? Awwww shucks, golly gee, gosh darn . . . :p *see photo below

Forgot to mention this in one of my earlier posts - my Classic 30 is an older unit (1995), so it did not come with the now factory-spec Blue Marvel speaker. The one that came stock was kind of an anemic little number, which I am assuming was a Peavey-made unit. After re-thinking that for awhile, the speaker situation alone may have had something to do with my non-preference of the Groove Tubes that I'd dropped in there prior to the J & J's. Personally, I like the sound of Groove Tubes, and those Mullard re-issues may end up being the next tube of choice when the time comes to re-tube the Peavey (though it may be awhile before that happens). Bottom line: Nothing will kill the sweet tones you'll get with a re-tube faster than a cruddy-sounding speaker. And vice versa - nothing will make your re-tube sound better than a really good speaker.

It'd be interesting to know what year the Blue Marvel became the stock speaker in the Classic 30 amp.
 
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The Osmonds. hahahahahaha Marie's kinda hot in a weird way though. ;)

I'm wondering if I should email Peavey and give them my serial number to find out the date of production. Yeah I definately agree that a good speaker will make new tubes sound their best. I'm glad to find out it already did have a good one and my Jube is glad to have her speaker back and I can spend those bones for a new speaker on something else.
 
I really like the 15" Blue Marvel speaker in my Delta Blues. As you might expect with a speaker this size, it's got a real nice bottom--great thump for those SRV Texas shuffle bass lines I love. The top end is very good, as well, with good bite and clarity. Can't comment on the smaller 10" and 12" Blue Marvels, but I have no plans of changing out my 15-incher! I've read some disparaging comments about the Blue Marvels, but you sure couldn't prove it by my experience. But I should also point out that I play at fairly low volumes, so maybe they're not as good when pushed hard?

BTW, I've read that the Blue Marvels are made for Peavey by Eminence. Can anybody confirm?
 
I dunno dood I push my little 12 Blue Marvel pretty hard and it still retains clarity and warmth and in fact it sounds better the more you drive the volume. Since getting the new tubes I've been playing it at about 3/4 of the way up just cause it sounds so sweet! I would think the 15 you got would SMOKE! Crack that *#%@ up!
 
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Katastrophe said:
Well, he IS a little bit country (and a little bit rock n' roll)!:DR :R :D
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Good one, Kat! Amazingly enough, the statement is very applicable in my case. I always get a good laugh out of the fact that a lot of "country" stuff permeates my own sound these days, esp. now that I've become quite seriously afflicted by the classic Fender tone.

But *ahem* getting back to the tubes - I also have J & J replacements in my Valve Jr., and have been very pleased with them as well. I am especially anxious to see how things pan out once my Jr.'s "Voodoo Mod" is complete. :D
 

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