Just got a 96 MIA HotRod DeVille 410

[ShortBuSX]

When the "Stimulus payment" was even first mentioned Id instantly ear-marked that money for a new amp. I was convinced I was going to get a Blue Deluxe, although I did try to talk myself out of it by trying and researching other amps such as the Vox AC15CC, Traynor 40 & 50(testing wasnt an option), Blues Jr RI, HR Deluxe and of course the Blues Deluxe...but I was sold on the Blues Deluxe, EVEN with all the outrageous claims of "flimsy circuit boards" that seem to be all over the place on internet forums.
Id received a notice from the IRS saying I could expect my check on the 13th, even though their website said the 16th *shrug*...there very next day I received a mailer from Guitar Center offering 15% off. It almost seemed etched in stone that I was gonna get the BDeluxe, Id had plans to go this weekend and pick her up...but the check didnt show Friday or Saturday, so my WONDERFUL new girlfriend and I went to the beach instead, BUT on the way to the beach is an awesome Mom & Pop music store that carries a nice line of Fender gear, to my surprise the new GF was more than willing to stop and watch me test drive a few amps along the way to the beach, she really didnt believe I could spend $600 or more on an amp...that is until she saw a Tweed RI(which looks almost exactly like a Blues Deluxe) for $1300. And began to show her all the other high dollar amps but then spotted a used DeVille for only $399!!! I immediately looked at the back and discovered it was made in the USA and figured it was a mid 90s, still had the OEM Fender red tubes...I plugged in and took it for a test, sounded great...but I was on my way to the beach, and besides I hadnt been "stimulated" yet so I didnt really have the money yet. Once we were at the beach my girl was all "you really want that amp dont you? I'll give you the money till you get your check." I declined, Ive got good credit and a nice limit, but is this girl a keeper or what?! But the more I thought about it, the more it sounded like a great deal...and the more I gravitated towards pullin the trigger on this one. We went to lunch and my mind was made up, but it was already past 5pm on a Sat! The best I could hope for was them to close at 6pm. We pulled in the lot at 5:40 and I saw the store owner out havin a smoke, walked past him to a locked front door, argh! So I turned to him and asked about the DeVille, told him I was interested and he opened the doors back up(they closed at 5:30)...he said "anything to make a sale"...and she was MINE!!!

I'll add more to this later...

 

[mrmudcat]

Destiny............is a beautiful thing:AOK:

 

[marnold]

*sniff* I love a happy ending! *sniff*

 

[ShortBuSX]

My buddy's have band practice on Saturday nights, so I immediately hauled my DeVille over there and let my buddy jam with it that evening, I really like hearing talent play through my gear, I like this cause Im able to listen closer and more attentively...hes got a HRDlx so hes familiar with the controls, sounded great!

At first glance the only problem with this amp is the handle is broke, but Ive already found a replacement online.
Once I got the amp home, made room for it and got her all hooked up and set up for bedroom levels(which IS possible BTW) I noticed small things like a few scratchy pots, but then also notices some small fluctuations in the volume coming in and out...I tapped on the preamp tubes and found a rattly one, got one from a buddy and Im good to go now! Strangely enough, these are the original OEM Fender Red labeled tubes...no biggie as Id probably change out the tubes before they were due otherwise, now Ive got a reason.

Please read this:
Over the last month Ive done plenty of research about the Deluxe/Deville, Ive gone to just about every guitar forum and used their search feature and read just about every topic that mentions either amp. Ive gotta say Im shocked at the reputation these amps have online and how they still manage to be THE most popular amp.
Most of the topics were based on a poster with minor issues like mine, fluctuations with volume dropping in and out, and other various noise complaints...all of which could be contributed to old or bad tubes.
But with these minor complaints, other posters making claims about flimsy circuit boards and FAILURES. I read countless numbers of posters making these claims, on multiple forums. Ive read these complaints for days upon days, but I still didnt let this deter me. I still continue to read these, but I have pretty much come to the conclusion that this is damn near unfounded!
Ive only read a scant few who ACTUALLY had any kind of CB issue, and one that comes to mind is a gentleman who bought a Torres kit and modded his CB and then it died.(period) This same person would post his beef in just about every topic that included the term Deluxe or Deville, I also get the impression that he is well respected by that forum, so then of course everybody regurgitates his beef as gospel, and then it spreads to other forums. Forum upon forum beats this line of amps up for flimsy CBs and failures...but there are a scant FEW(less than a handful) that are anything more than tube related issues that could be easily remedied by a simple tube change.
Having owned this amp for 4 days and reading countless posts and topics doesnt make me an expert on these amps, but I do believe there is alot of mis-information being said/spread, as there arent but a select handful(at best) of failures reported of said CBs....but mostly these topics read like rumors and repeating what they had "learned" from what they have read on the internet....and the rest read like tube issues.

Im also reading things that say this isnt a bedroom amp, that it could never be used for bedroom levels...I say dont let this discourage you, I am totally loving this amp! If you move the input jack to the low input side, this amp becomes less boomy and brightens up nicely. Ive got my amp set at levels that are comfortable for me, close my door on my room, and have confirmed with my roommate that its not bothersome...and even at low volumes, this thing had such a well rounded tone that Im am thuroughly pleased! Your results may vary...maybe youve got a new born thats a light sleeper *shrug*

I plan on installing lower gain preamp tubes to help make it more bedroom level worthy(and then later power tubes), but have no intentions of doing any other mods...although the forums are rather convincing that mods are a necessary evil to tame this "beast".

Lastly, I cant begin to count the number of people who complain that this amp has only one useable channel, WTF??? Clean, drive and (even)more drive are awesome! Ive got the Screamin Banshee(DVM's tubescreamer clone) and a Double Muff that Im almost thinkin arent really needed anymore! But I will continue to use them as it gives me the feel of even more channels and options. I dont think I will ever understand how one could deem the other 2 channels "useless", I dont care what genre you prefer to play!

Im lovin this amp...WTF is wrong with the rest of the world? I just dont get it.

:rockon: :dude:

 

[warren0728]

i love when a plan comes together....a lot of times people only go to forums to complain....just like if you get great service at a restaurant you might tell a few people but if the service or food was lousy you tell everyone!

enjoy that amph....hopefully you get many screamin' solos out of that thing! :beer:

ww

 

[Ch0jin]

Im lovin this amp...WTF is wrong with the rest of the world? I just dont get it.

:rockon: :dude:

In short man, they aren't you If everyone in the world liked the same thing we'd all be playing the same guitar through the same amp. How boring would that be?

 

[just strum]

With all the writing, when have you had time to play it?

Sounds like someone is happy, but we're not!!!

 

[sunvalleylaw]

Congrats! and do post pics/clips!

 

[ShortBuSX]

Thanks everybody...I am quite pleased.
I have been playing the amp alot, but Im still feelin my way around the settings, I'll hook my MIM Strat up and then twist the knobs, then with pedals, and then twist some more, and then noodle around some more...Im really diggin the Strat through it, pretty damn sweet with the volume rolled back a lil. Im getting nice tones from Jimi to John Mayer to Clapton out of this...totally diggin it.
Then go through more of the same with my Epi LP Standard and then my Squier Tele...but I havent got any firm settings on those yet, but I am taking notes when I do find something appealing, so Im able to find my way back.

I wont likely be taking any pics or posting any clips though. I dont really have any recording gear or any songs that Id like to showcase...and she pretty much looks like any other Deville 410(big black/silver and square...pretty red light). Dont get me wrong, shes purdy...but Ive recently had some gear stolen, so Im still kinda sketch posting pics of new gear.

ChOjin, I know were all different, special and unique...but I dont think that makes any of these channels "useless" as decsribed by many of the posters throughout the internet forums.
Ive been going the route of setting the "clean" channel to my liking, then going to the "more drive" channel and dialing in the gain to taste, once you get that dialed in then I change to the "drive" channel and its already seasoned to a pleasant tone thats slightly more driven than the "clean" so it breaks up sooner...once youve done this, whats not "useful"?
Seriously, set like this I hardly feel the need for my OD or Muff pedal...but my LP loves that Muff pedal, so Im certain I'll find a use for em.

I purchased a couple of the Winged C SED 6L6 power tubes and a couple of the JJ 12AX7 and a couple JJ 12AT7 and one EH 12AY7 to mix and match in the preamp section....hopefully they get here before the weekend!

Im still reading through the forums, I found one guy with a legit gripe, but it has nothing to do with a "flimsy CB", nor is it a "failure"...the repair looks rather minor, the topic even has a link to the Deluxe pages for the repair.
random channel switching

 

[ShortBuSX]

My tubes arrived on Friday and I scored a free multi-meter from work(it was given to me). I made myself familiar with biasing by watching the "How To Video" at Eurotubes(excellent read and detailed pics below the video) and read even more about "How To bias the Hotrod Deluxe/Deville".
I removed the back cover and was pleasntly surprised to see how clean and new looking everything was inside this amp, just how Id expect a brand new amp to look(but 12 years old?)...no signs of excess heat, or dis-coloration and dust free.
I plugged the amp in, turned it on and 5 minutes later probed the bias of the OEM Fender red tubes @ 58mv, factory spec I believe is @ 60mv. I turned the amp off and removed the Fender power tubes and install the Winged "C" SED SV6L6GC's fired it back up waited bout 10 minutes, probed and got an instant 73-74mv...without even turning the bias adjuster, I just left it there as that was my target. I buttoned everything up and then plugged my Strat in. Im not really good at describing tone, but Id left all my settings the same with no adjustments or tweeks to the knobs...but the staticy, cracky, brittle noise is gone and now the tone is clear, round and full sounding.
I played around for a minute taking it all in from the clean, drive and more drive channels...very nice.

The preamp tubes were fun to play round with, I kept(for the first round) the Fender red 12AX7s in V1 and V2, but then installed a "balanced"(because it came recommended by varioius sources to get it "balanced") EH 12AY7 in the V3 slot, this just made everything sound clearer and more defined(to me).
But then I installed a JJ's 12AT7 in V1 and that settled the boom-iness/loudness...volume was still there, just not as punchy/intense.
I installed another of the JJ's 12AT7 in V2 and thats when things got interesting, this knocked the gain down nicely...if you like cleans youll love this. When changing between channels, the drive channel was like the clean with a nice mild break up...and the "more drive" channel was still pretty damn clean with a sooner break up. Even with the gain maxed she still maintained a nice blues driven tone on the clean side. Id get alot of use out of my pedals with this set up, but wouldnt get much 80s metal tone-age.
I then tried a JJ's 12AX7 in V2 and now have a nice balance in the gain department, a level that is useable for me in all 3 channels that I can kick up a couple of notches if need be with my pedals.
Id kinda like to try a 5751 somewhere in V1 or V2, but wasnt aware of it when I made my purchase, so I'll just have to try em later...but mixing and swapping the different tubes around, I think Im gonna keep it right where its at for the time being...its verry nice!
I cant help but smile when I think about

 

[ShortBuSX]

I decided to check the bias on the SED 6L6's again now that Ive got some hours on em. I had them biased to 73-74mv but theyed drifted to 68mv....so I decided to try playing and compairing hotter and colder for tone. I tried hotter about 80mv and noticed the tone to be very mid heavy masking the highs. I tried various stopping points turning the bias down colder and trying again. The lower the bias the more the tone cleaned up and the better the highs, mids and lows blended...until I got down to the 50mv range, and then it sounded like a crappy out of tune junk guitar, the higher notes just didnt sound pleasant, not very melodic, I really dont know how to describe it any better.
I continued to tweak between 60 and 70mv until I settled at a very pleasant 62mv...just a hair above factory spec, go figure :thwap:

 

[tjcurtin1]

[/QUOTE]

Strum - took me a minute to figure out what the smiley was pulling out from...errr... behind him!

ShortBusX - glad you found 'your' amph - have fun with it!

 

[Rocket]

I wouldn't consider my DeVille a "bedroom amp".
People who throw hate on the DeVille's usually NEVER use them anywhere near their potential... DeVille's are made for venue-filling power.
I wouldn't imagine a Lamborghini Murcielago GTR would do very well in a stock-car race either.

 

[ShortBuSX]

I wouldn't consider my DeVille a "bedroom amp".
People who throw hate on the DeVille's usually NEVER use them anywhere near their potential... DeVille's are made for venue-filling power.
I wouldn't imagine a Lamborghini Murcielago GTR would do very well in a stock-car race either.

I dont consider this a bedroom amp either, but thats where it currently resides.
For me, coming from a Vox AD30vt, I consider this an affordable tone monster that I can grow into, as maybe one day I'll have a band of my own. I occasionally jam with some friends and she is a chore to haul, but it sounds really nice and mixes well with his HRDeluxe...it also holds its own with my buddy's 300w 410 bass cab and amp.

As stated, this isnt really a bedroom amp, but Ive got an attenuator in my sights for the near future. But considering this Deville vs the AD30? Even at bedroom level, my roommate cant hear it at midnight(granted his room is other end of the house), even though Im not driving the power tubes hard, Im getting deep tone that Ive never known with excellent clean sparkly highs. And after trying and testing different combinations of preamp tubes, Im quite pleased with the drive channels...so for a "bedroom amp", shes doin alright.

Having said all that, Id rather buy a used Blues Jr than an attenuator...although both is more likely, as I dont see myself ever getting rid of this amp.

And for $400? What else are you gonna get that can deliver that low end shape? My strats love this amp!!!!!

 

[mrmudcat]

I love my HRD:master:

I know of one or two minor concerns personally.

1.)The plastic input jack will fail eventually.(not sure if your usa made is plastic my mexico HRD is:thwap: )

2.)It flat out goes from 0-100 fast.In other words as suggested an attenuator or volume box is needed for bedroom levels.


On a side note my jewel blew and I replaced it but it still glows bright and dim at times .Very minor though.I do have a celestion vintage-30 in mine and I like it!:rockon:

 

[ShortBuSX]

I love my HRD:master:

My buddy's got a HRD, and it pretty much sold me on a Blues Deluxe, but then I stumbled on this deal and couldnt turn it down.

I know of one or two minor concerns personally.

1.)The plastic input jack will fail eventually.(not sure if your usa made is plastic my mexico HRD is:thwap: )

Input #1 is already a lil flimsy from the previous owner, but I like input #2 better anyways. I keep it at home most of the time so nobody's really gonna trip over mah cord. Im using pedals so Ive only got a 6 foot cord coiled to the floor into the pedal chain, Ive also used electrical tape to tape a kink free loop at the cords end going into input 2...so Ive got several fail safes in place to keep from damaging mine, but if Im moving it around more often I could totally see how I could damage them.

2.)It flat out goes from 0-100 fast.In other words as suggested an attenuator or volume box is needed for bedroom levels.

The master volume is rather touchy, but after you change the preamp tubes, especially the phase inverter, to say a 12AT7, it makes it a lil less touchy and less boom-y.
BUT with both the above mentioned concerns, I plan on taking this amp to a tech soon to have both concerns addressed as well as a few others.
I think I found a source for a 1meg snap in audio taper pot for the master.
I also found replacement input jacks for cheap.
And then have the tone stack mod done.
I dunno how much labor would be(I reckon 70 and hour?) but the parts are very affordable.

On a side note my jewel blew and I replaced it but it still glows bright and dim at times .Very minor though.I do have a celestion vintage-30 in mine and I like it!:rockon:

Ive been reading EVERYTHING I can HRD and HRDeville related, Ive read similar complaints about the jewel...if memory serves me correctly, I believe your replacement bulb is to blame, I think Ive read that the top of the bulb is slightly larger than the OEM so it doesnt fit into the jewel lens the same. As strange/simple as it may sound, try an oem replacement bulb.
But I'll also keep an eye open if I come across another post/topic concerning that for you.

 

[Robert]

That's a heavy amp to lug around, isn't it? It sure sounds good - I know.

I think Tremoloman uses one too.

 

[ShortBuSX]

That's a heavy amp to lug around, isn't it? It sure sounds good - I know.

I think Tremoloman uses one too.

The websites all claim 54 lbs...but I think I read somewhere its more like 63 lbs, Im pretty sure the 212 is 54 lbs.

Its almost easier to pick it up by both sides and carry it outright than to use the handle and limp along.

BTW speaking of which, the handle was busted when I bought it, but I was able to find a replacement online for less than $13...and now shes as good as new!

And you are absolutely correct, she sounds beautiful, I go through withdraws if Im not able to get an hour or more in each day on her *shakes*trembles*

 

[Brian Krashpad]

Congrats! I like 4x10s for guitar. I have a '60's Super Reverb, and the prior owner modded it into halves (top half is a 2x10 combo and bottom half a 2x10 extension cab). Makes it a bit easier to carry and store. Plus if I get a wild hair I can mate the top with my 2x12 cab instead, and run a 2x10+2x12!

 

[mrmudcat]

Short: Yea the bulb is a oem one but ive read similiar things about it fitting right??? It gets brighter when your playing then dims when idle


The audio taper pot and jacks are mods ill be doing also.Easy quick cheap my 3 favorite words.

I got replacement J.J.tubes that rock and im not really into taming it down!!!!!:dude:

Peace brother enjoy it!

 

[ShortBuSX]

The audio taper pot and jacks are mods ill be doing also.Easy quick cheap my 3 favorite words.

Everything Ive read so far suggests using Search for part # R-VHD-250KA
But thats only a 250K Audio taper, appearantly that seems to work well but a 1Meg audio taper pot is actually called for.
I found this the other day, but Im not 100% that it will actually work, but I notice it does say "Blues Deville" and the shaft is D-shaped *shrug*
http://www.angela.com/catalog/guitar-amp-parts/FENDER_AMP_PARTS.html

Fender Snap In Mini Pots For Recent Amplifiers!

17. 1 Meg Audio Taper, 1/4" 'D' shaped shaft for push-on knobs. Genuine Fender Part Number 004-1507-000. "10A1M0730Q" stamped on top. Used as a Master Volume pot in the Blues DeVille etc. EACH $8.99.

I got replacement J.J.tubes that rock and im not really into taming it down!!!!!:dude:

I over use the word tame for this amp, a 12AT7 will get you more of a vintage Fender sound as all the vintage Tweed amps used a 12AT7 in the phase inverter(as well as the other preamp slots). I find it makes the clean sound more broad and less mid/low punchy/boomy...and with all of the same volume, but because its less punchy, the master seems less "touchy"...tamed a lil.

If you want the drive channel to be more useful try a 5751 or 12AT7 in V1 or V2...youll find "tube screamers" to be thin and flimsy in compairison.
But you gotta use a 12AX7 in either V1 or V2...other wise you lose the headroom you are concerned with...but even I dont care for lower gain tubes in ALL 3 preamp slots.
I highly recommend anybody with this amp or any Hotrod to try different preamp valve combos...once again, ITS DIRT CHEAP and sounds as good if not better than new pickups! I cant imagine a speaker swap without doing this first.
At the least change the inverter tube, youll thank me later :AOK:

 

[ShortBuSX]

Oh yeah, almost forgot...the one thing thats annoying me with this amp at bedroom levels, which yall(Mud and Rocket) will never have a problem with is tube rattle! The lows just rattle the hell out of em!
The only thing I can come up with to remedy this is "tube dampers", high temp o-rings :thwap:
Hope that helps, but Im slackin on ordering them...

 

[mrmudcat]

Short:My HRD came with rubber tube dampers (Awesome!) I have 1 meg pots fender if you want one (for guitar but as long as the shaft is just as long I see no problem)

The kit I got in mine is this.
Fender HRD High Gain Option #1
A pair of the JJ 6L6GC's for maximum output along with three hand picked high gain ECC83S's with one of them being balanced for the phase inverter in V3.

http://eurotubes.com/


Just google fender tube dampers and they have a shiat load on ebay as well as other places!!!!!(If you havent googled already!)

 

[ShortBuSX]

Short:My HRD came with rubber tube dampers (Awesome!) I have 1 meg pots fender if you want one (for guitar but as long as the shaft is just as long I see no problem)

The kit I got in mine is this.
Fender HRD High Gain Option #1
A pair of the JJ 6L6GC's for maximum output along with three hand picked high gain ECC83S's with one of them being balanced for the phase inverter in V3.

http://eurotubes.com/


Just google fender tube dampers and they have a shiat load on ebay as well as other places!!!!!(If you havent googled already!)

Thanks for offering me your pot ancake:
But Im really looking for a "snap in" like the OEM...I just dont want my amp to appear "modded" and for my mods to be clean and OEM like...thats also why Im gonna avoid the switchcraft input jacks, even though they ARE better.:thwap:

I read alot of good things about JJ tubes, so naturally I went to Eurotubes...but then I had to learn about all the JJ tube numbers to know what I was buying, once I did, I soon realized that Eurotubes was more expensive and that I could get JJ tubes from TubeDepot for less...it also made me learn about other tubes.
If you like JJ's...BUY THIS TUBE(balanced) for your phase inverter(V3).
Keep everything else the same, you dont have to rebias when changing preamp tubes(some people arent aware).
I think its a significant improvement that even your bandmates will notice. :AOK:
Think of it, like Id said earlier, like new(better) pickups...but for only $12!!!:dude:

 

[ShortBuSX]

I built a "volume box" for my Deville tonight, out of spare parts and an empty cigarette pack(early prototype for me)...plugged it in and it works great! :bravo:
I can see how this would be handy...set all your volume settings for business and then adjust this volume box for what the situation requires...then you dont have to go balancing the volume and the master everytime...just one knob, nice. :beer:

 

[sunvalleylaw]

I had fun playing through a Deville at GC today while I was testing out guitars. I liked it!

 

[M29]

Hello ShortBuSX,

I picked up a blue jewel and bulb for a HRDx I had a while back and never put it in. You can have it if you want. Send me a PM on where to send it to if you could use it.

M29

 

[ShortBuSX]

Sweet! Thanks! :beer:
Blue IS mah favorite color!
Thats one of those things Id want, but dont see myself ever placing an order or even paying for, so thank you very much!


As Id posted before, Ive been having tube rattle...I ordered a set of damping rings off of ebay, but then I also called Fender and explained to them that Id purchased a used 96 HRDv and it didnt come with the "tube stabilizer" foam thingy, so they mailed me out one. Got it today and it looks like it may do the trick...if not, the damping rings should arrive tomorrow.

 

[ShortBuSX]

I received my tube dampers as well as the Fender tube stabilizer. The tube stabilizer looked like it might tame some of the rattle on V2 and V3 but I wanted to try the o-ring dampers as I suspected I was getting some rattle out of V1 and the power tubes as well...you could just tap on the back of the amp and hear em jingling. Theyre a lil snug to get on, so you might wanna take the tubes off first before putting them on. But once on they worked great...my amp is pretty silent now and Im able to enjoy all its sweetness.
Heres a pic of the o-ring tube dampers I got off Ebay. And Id never seen a pic of the Fender tube stabilizer online, no matter how much Id searched, not even much mention of a part number...had I seen a pic, I might or might not have bothered, just trying to help, so heres a pic:

And heres a pic of my volume box that I built, actually works quite well, although crude.

Well finally, this is mah "bedroom amp", the monster at the foot of my bed, my newest piece of furniture...

...and 3 fancy hat racks.

 

[mrmudcat]

Nice pics !! Does the ebay seller have any more of those rings id like some!?