Who likes Grunge?

[tunghaichuan]

I liked grunge when it first started. It was fresh and new sounding after the hair metal bands became a self-parody of themselves.

I think some grunge was punk inspired; e.g., Nirvana, and some bands like Soundgarden were more metal/Black Sabbath inspired. Since it all came from a specific geographic region, there was a lot of cross pollination going on.

I still remember hearing "Smells Like Teen Spirit" for the first time. It was the voice of Gen X crying out in protest against all the yuppie/boomer types.

Ultimately, it died the way a lot of musical trends die; out of nowhere the grassroots level bands become popular, then the recording industry takes notice, signs lots of bands and ultimately waters it down making it self parody.

I liked some of it, but some of it did come off as pretentious and/or whiny.

 

[pes_laul]

Layne Staley is actually the late lead singer of Alice in Chains. Jerry Cantrell is the guitarist. I agree that he is very good.

:thwap I always got them mixed up haha.

 

[FrankenFretter]

Like Steve, I'm from the PNW. I guess I'm still there, technically, although it seems far removed from the PNW I know and love. I lived in the Seattle area from 1990 to 1994, so I was right in the middle of it. Although I was never a huge fan of Nirvana (they do have some stuff I like, just not enough to own it), I loved Soundgarden (Kim Thayill has a HUGE guitar sound, even if he doesn't wallow in solos), Alice in Chains, and Pearl Jam. To me, Ten was Pearl Jam's opus and could never be followed up on, sort of like Meatloaf's Bat Out of Hell. That's just me though.

The Grunge movement was a neccessary change, I think. The air had become stagnant, and the scene needed to be shaken. I don't listen to much of that stuff now, but I'm sure it had a hand in shaping some of my musical choices these days.

As for Grunge being depressing, that is true for some of it for sure. Steve mentioned that Kurt Cobain was from Aberdeen; if you've ever been there, you'd understand why he might have been depressed. And then there's all the rain we get in the Northwest...that can also be depressing. Maybe that's what Grunge really was...the voice of the rainclouds.

That's my opinion, for what it's worth.

 

[Commodore 64]

I remember someone saying "Why don't Kurt Cobain, Billy Corgan and Eddie Vedder just commit suicide already and get it over with." It was pretty funny at the time. I thought it was hilarious given the whiny, angry, angsty, complaining nature of their songs. Then Kurt went and did it. I definitely didn't think it was funny, but I can't say that I was surprised, either.

 

[Eric]

I remember someone saying "Why don't Kurt Cobain, Billy Corgan and Eddie Vedder just commit suicide already and get it over with." It was pretty funny at the time. I thought it was hilarious given the whiny, angry, angsty, complaining nature of their songs. Then Kurt went and did it. I definitely didn't think it was funny, but I can't say that I was surprised, either.

Nice. I do think that's pretty funny, although it's harder to say that since Kurt went and ruined the joke...

Makes me wonder what sort of comparable remarks I'd have about the emo scene if I bothered to pay any attention to that at all.

 

[pes_laul]

Nice. I do think that's pretty funny, although it's harder to say that since Kurt went and ruined the joke...

Makes me wonder what sort of comparable remarks I'd have about the emo scene if I bothered to pay any attention to that at all.

:dance

 

[Eric]

:dance

Awesome.

 

[Kazz]

Glad you cleared that up Rev.....I was about to go back and look at my AIC collection to see if I missed Layne playing guitar somewhere.

 

[sunvalleylaw]

Sometimes, Grunge can serve as a coping tool, if used sparingly. Example: Back when I was a public defender, particularly in juvenile or child protection matters, I would find myself involved in disputes involving multiple levels of unreasonable inept or more likely simply over worked . . . (remainder deleted to avoid politics. Suffice it to say I was frustrated). I would find myself hauling my butt down to court for a hearing that was (text deleted, replaced again with frustrating.)

On the way down to court, I would like to put on this song and scream along for 5 minutes . . .


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t9sHoDrNEPg

After doing so, I had it out of my system, and could speak in a productive way to the lawyers, judges and people involved, without losing it.

Then later, I would like to listen to something more positive. But on the way to court, it provided a much needed release.

"Coping with Cobain"? A new self help book?

 

[sunvalleylaw]

I like flannel shirts and patterns. I wear a lot of it. But I pretty much hate grunge. I freakin' HATE Nirvana (Like, part of original grunge), and their offspring. I don't really know what "grunge" really is but I pretty much despise: Nickelback (dislike, post grunge posers), Foo Fighters (ok, but post grunge), Pearl Jam (Grunge, like some, don't like some), 3 Doors Down( don't even know those guys), Creed (way post grunge, too polished and posey), Nirvana [I](As said, I like)[/I], Alice in Chains (Lots of good stuff here, more polished than most grunge) (Except for the Dirt album), Soundgarden (Like, Cornell has great vocals) (except for the song, Pretty Noose), Candle Box (Big dislike, copiers), Bush (Same), Green Day (like, but different category, pop punk). That's all garbage that makes me want to gouge my ears out. I don't know if it's all "grunge", but to me grunge started the decline of music into what it is today and includes all of those craptastic bands.

It's awful. I'd take the worst hair band over the best grunge band every day of the week and 2x on Sundays.

I also dislike a few of the bands you posted above. Grunge was over by the time Nickelback came around. I inserted my opinions about the bands you mentioned above. To me, real grunge was largely unproduced, was indie, was rebellious against what had been going on. When it became a national thing that record labels wanted a part of, and bands started trying to sound like grunge, it was over. Tung and Hubberjub hit that right on the head in their posts above.

 

[Eric]

I also dislike a few of the bands you post. Grunge was over by the time Nickelback came around. I inserted my opinions about the bands you mentioned above. To me, real grunge was largely unproduced, was indie, was rebellious against what had been going on. When it became a national thing that record labels wanted a part of, and bands started trying to sound like grunge, it was over. Tung hit that right on the head in his post above.

This is turning a smidge defensive, so I'm going to play the part of moderator and tell everyone to cool it just a little. I wanted to defend 90s music too, but...it's OK. Live and let live. Your taste in music might be awesome, it might suck...but it's yours. That's OK.

 

[sunvalleylaw]

This is turning a smidge defensive, so I'm going to play the part of moderator and tell everyone to cool it just a little. I wanted to defend 90s music too, but...it's OK. Live and let live. Your taste in music might be awesome, it might suck...but it's yours. That's OK.

Eric, thanks. I did not notice how I typed that and it might have been misconstrued. I corrected my post to make it more clear. I was trying to agree with C-64 about some of the bands he mentioned that he did not care for. I hope I was not otherwise overly defensive while defending my opinion (I could get really going if I let myself. I was very rebellious against 60's and some 70's era music at the time. I have since moderated. Since taking up guitar, I am open to a lot of stuff I had passed over before.). If I was overly defensive, I agree; Live and let live. ancake

 

[red]

And what was up with all the flannel?

The flannel is, I believe, the fault of the business part of the music industry. If you watch the "Hype!" documentary, the people actually playing the music in Seattle were at best amused with the flannel thing. Those who wore it, wore it simply because it was cold, and it was extremely cheap. Same thing with the Converse shoes. It was never a deliberate attempt to create any kind of fashion out of it.

But by the time something gets out there and the right people smell money, it's pretty much out of the original idea man's hands (just look at some of the uses Nobel's dynamite has today).

While I like flannel myself because of it's feel and thermal properties, I feel it's got nothing to do with the grunge music itself, and picking on it to make a point about grunge's worth is not unlike saying that an ugly wart on somebody's face invalidates his position in an argument.

There's a few modern rock acts I like. Tool, Alice in Chains... but that's about it.

I'm pretty sure that neither Tool nor any critic/CD-label-man ever claimed their music to be grunge.

 

[red]

I like flannel shirts and patterns. [...] But I pretty much hate grunge. [...] I don't really know what "grunge" really is but I pretty much despise: [...] I don't know if it's all "grunge", but to me grunge started the decline of music into what it is today and includes all of those craptastic bands.

I'm sorry to have to be the one who enforces Godwin's law in this thread, but hating something that you only have a superficial idea about is what made concentration camps possible.

 

[red]

Sure, I like grunge.. Nirvana, Pearl Jam, Soundgarden, &c. Good music, but lacking in guitar solos. It is, what it is..

Pearl Jam's music is actually full of solos. The SRV/Hendrix influenced Mike McCready takes care of that quite generously. Look up a live version of "Black" or "Even Flow" for minutes of extended soloing.

 

[red]

I remember someone saying "Why don't Kurt Cobain, Billy Corgan and Eddie Vedder just commit suicide already and get it over with." It was pretty funny at the time. I thought it was hilarious given the whiny, angry, angsty, complaining nature of their songs. Then Kurt went and did it. I definitely didn't think it was funny, but I can't say that I was surprised, either.

Well, Kurt Vonnegut had this to say:

"I sometimes wondered what the use of any of the arts was. The best thing I could come up with was what I call the canary in the coal mine theory of the arts. This theory says that artists are useful to society because they are so sensitive. They are super-sensitive. They keel over like canaries in poison coal mines long before more robust types realize that there is any danger whatsoever."

So if the artist is actually sincere, and the public wise enough to make the difference, I'd say that's an extremely valuable social service right there. And rather than making jokes about them killing themselves and getting it over with, sometimes it just might be safer for everyone to recognize and address the problem, and maybe give a "thanks" in passing to those who pointed it out.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[Commodore 64]

I'm sorry to have to be the one who enforces Godwin's law in this thread, but hating something that you only have a superficial idea about is what made concentration camps possible.

ROFLMAO. You can't be serious. You just can't. You can't possibly be trying to correlate comments about "grunge" on an internet forum with the Holocaust, can you? Really?

 

[sunvalleylaw]

One last thought, in turning the discussion back to liking grunge as a form of music. Let's consider who is still left. Pearl Jam, and I do like their last album. Has some good rocking stuff on it. Foo Fighters, even though they came into existence after early grunge had passed on to some thing else. They have had a good long career, and still can rock quite well. The new version of Alice in Chains, Cantrell still rocks, and they have a good new singer, though Staley's voice is missed. Soundgarden, Cornell and Thayl still rock, and Soundgarden had a reunion recently.

So keeping it simple, as a form of rock music, I still like it. There are good, big guitar sounds, even if the guitar is not used as much for soloing by some acts, good strong vocals, big drums, and it tends to rock.

Oh, and these guys are still around, doing the local, indie thing they started with:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zrUA7kOySZQ&feature=related

The Melvins and Green River are still out there playing too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v_XV...64C12FF3&playnext_from=PL&playnext=1&index=25

More or less loud, arguably sloppy, indie, blues based,garage rock, maybe with some punk attitude. No wonder I like it sometimes.

 

[red]

ROFLMAO. You can't be serious. You just can't. You can't possibly be trying to correlate comments about "grunge" on an internet forum with the Holocaust, can you? Really?

Well, the definition for Godwin's law at the link I posted did use the word "humorous", so a certain level of self-irony was involved, but you don't like grunge so probably not your cup of tea communication-style-wise .
:beer:

 

[Rockermann]

I'm pretty sure that neither Tool nor any critic/CD-label-man ever claimed their music to be grunge.

Nor did I. I went off the grunge topic a bit to include modern rock as a whole.

 

[Rockermann]

While I like flannel myself because of it's feel and thermal properties, I feel it's got nothing to do with the grunge music itself, and picking on it to make a point about grunge's worth is not unlike saying that an ugly wart on somebody's face invalidates his position in an argument.

Sorry, if I insulted. No harm was intended.

There's nothing wrong with flannel. I own some myself. But I sure as hell wouldn't put it on knowing I'm going on stage.

 

[red]

Nor did I. I went off the grunge topic a bit to include modern rock as a whole.

I see. Excuse my part in the misunderstanding then.

 

[red]

Sorry, if I insulted. No harm was intended.

There's nothing wrong with flannel. I own some myself. But I sure as hell wouldn't put it on knowing I'm going on stage.

I wasn't insulted at all, it's just that the thread seemed to go on a "flannel" tangent a tad more than it seemed relevant to the discussion, that's all. No harm done.

 

[sumitomo]

WOW! I never have really listened to any of this music,Yes in the 90's I lived in isolated in the mountains.The blues is my life and my life is the blues!@sunvalley Hey are you sure that band called Mudhoney isn't form San Francisco or Hollywood?LOL! Sumi

 

[sunvalleylaw]

Sumi, nope. Definitely formed in Seattle. Gotta love the red Hagstrom in the video above, rocking it on out in West Seattle!

 

[sumitomo]

I was just teasing,but with a name like Mudhoney,makes ya wonder! Sumi

 

[Retro Hound]

Certainly. In a word: METAL! :dude

Am I to understand these are supposed to be examples of what's GOOD? Cause I had to laugh they are so bad. Almost a parody in themselves. But then, that's just my opinion.

 

[Eric]

Am I to understand these are supposed to be examples of what's GOOD? Cause I had to laugh they are so bad. Almost a parody in themselves.

To each his own. I'm sure your music sucks bunnies too. What styles do you like? There's probably something out there currently that would float your boat.

 

[Commodore 64]

When i watched the the Lamb of God video, about 35 seconds in I was thinking, "OK, OK, I get it already. You know how do do a pinch harmonic." Then the vocalist started screaming like a yeti with bronchitis, so I pressed stop.

 

[Retro Hound]

To each his own. I'm sure your music sucks bunnies too. What styles do you like? There's probably something out there currently that would float your boat.

I have no doubt that my music sucks bunnies. I'm something of a music omnivore, but I guess that style of metal isn't for me. Currently some music I listen to includes Cross Canadian Ragweed, Ashley Cleavland, and The Choir is releasing a new album June 28th. I discovered Bonamassa here at this forum, so that's new to me as well. I agree that there is always good music, just sometimes one has to search harder to find it.

As to the grunge thing, I loved it when it happened. Music had gotten stale, as it does every 10 years or so, and needed something to kick it up a notch. Grunge opened the doors to lots of alternative bands and some very interesting music.