Why are Fender amps suddenly so expensive?

[Robert]

Fender seem to have jacked up their prices ridiculously.

600 bucks for a Blues Junior? What the?

http://guitars.musiciansfriend.com/...ior-15W-1x12-Tube-Guitar-Combo-Amp?sku=481861

And $675 for the Tweed Blues Junior? My oh my. I ain't paying that for that little amp.

Have Fender gone nuts? Who's gonna pay such prices for those amps?

 

[markb]

It's all over the net, Robert. Fender have just introduced a 30% across the board price rise. People at TGP are saying they'll never buy anything Fender again. Of course some of these are the same people that say they'll only buy US made gear, so draw your own conclusions. Here's a few results.

http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=fender+price+rise&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

 

[oldguy]

Never forget there are (at least for now) choices to the end all, be all, printed circuit board reissues. That's why I went with the Ceriatone hand-wired clone of a Dumble. Robert's Heatseeker is another example. So are these..............hand wired clones with rave reviews. I'd love to own one someday. And so goes the G.A.S..................

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=330308988758&indexURL=6#ebayphotohosting

 

[Rocket]

People are becoming hard pressed for funds, economy is tanking... so raise prices 30% across the board. Makes total sense, right?
Here's another thing I've noticed:
We, (wife & I,) keep hearing that retailers are offering up HUGE discounts and willing to negotiate prices so now is the time to get out there and shop. We decided to test that theory today with some new furniture shopping. Our previously favorite furniture bigstore who previously was always willing to dicker a bit with pricing refused to negotiate a single dollar on both sticker-price or even shipping/set-up.
We walked!
We got the same results in new car shopping last weekend on 3 different American auto dealerships... and they're taking govt handouts and begging for sales action. Walked away there too.
I get why people are opting for foreign offerings... obviously US manufacturers are still way too full of themselves and need the hard lessons they're about to receive!

 

[guitartango]

Robert

Before xmas I paid £320 for the FBJ , looks like a £50 hike now. The recommend retail price is £449 ! What gives with Fender, for the bucks i could buy another amp and maybe better than the FBJ.

Makes you want to buy USA doesnt it, when I can drive 40 miles and pickup a UK amp (maybe china) from Marshall.

Still a great Amp !

 

[wingsdad]

People are becoming hard pressed for funds, economy is tanking... so raise prices 30% across the board. Makes total sense, right?

Not totally, but if the MSRP of Fender gear you currently own just went up 30%, your gear just gained about 15-20% in resale value. So, if you're hard-pressed for funds, you now have a shot at making a few more bucks by shucking it.

 

[oldguy]

FWIW, I visited our one local Fender mom and pop shop this afternoon. They've had a Deluxe Reverb reissue for some time now. It was marked "gotta go!" at $819, not a bad price considering the recent Fender price increases. MF is now selling them at $1199. If not strapped for cash, I would've brought it home...................
Their new shipment of Fender guitars are priced to reflect the increase. Deluxe Player's Strat...$799. They almost always match MF and other big box stores. They lost their Gibson franchise a few yrs. back because they couldn't order enough inventory and leave it hanging, waiting for thousands of dollars worth merchandise to sell. I hope they can survive the Fender price increases, the economy crunch, and the looky-loos who wanna headbang and scratch guitars, but not buy them.

 

[wingsdad]

...our one local Fender mom and pop shop this afternoon. ... They lost their Gibson franchise a few yrs. back because they couldn't order enough inventory...

Same thing happened a couple of years ago to the local indy Fender shop here that had an Epiphone franchise until Gibson cut them off. They're still stuck with some now NOS Epi Masterbuilt acoustics, aging gracefully in the acoustic room (climate controlled, desert here). I stop in there from time to time. The rumour at NAMM last year (08) was that Fender was about to pull the plug on them ala the Gibson-Greed Phenomenon, but instead, they pulled their new Gretsch franchise from them and handed it over to their competitor, another local indy a/ka/ my Local GAS Station.

 

[Ch0jin]

Back at the end of last year pretty much every IT vendor announced price rises of 20-30% in -dealer- buy price for laptops and desktops in the Australian market as a result of the US dollar slipping.

If it's not made "at home" and you trade in USD (or in my specific case the double whammy of USD and Yen) -and- (and this is a very, important condition) you were walking the razors edge of profitability to be market competitive, then yes, prices had to go up 20-30% to keep approximately the same bottom line.

If you had loads of margin to start with, (see furniture and fashion industries to start with) then only smaller adjustments would have been needed (if at all).

All this is price to a reseller, not to the consumer. From a consumer point of view, some larger resellers were able to delay and/or minimize the price increase to consumers by amortizing the costs of the older "cheaper" stock with the newer higher prices stock, but eventually the increased costs were always going to hit the consumer.

Now I've not worked in the music biz, so I don't know how tight someone like Fenders margins are to their resellers, but I'd bet this price hike is a result of the situation I've described above.

Wingsdad I don't know if I agree with you about resale.

I thought resale value was relatively independent of RRP (or MSRP as you say), being very dependent on supply and demand. Simply, the more of something thats available in the 2nd hand market, the more chance there is someone will accept below market price, thus driving the market price position down. If we all had '59 Les Paul's at home then they would not be worth far in excess of their MSRP like they are now for example.

 

[t_ross33]

I noticed that the Squier Vintage Modified HS Tele that I bought for $350 a couple of years ago is now $465 at a local retailer :thwap:

 

[Rocket]

Regardless of their price hike I must stick with Fender amps as I've not found a worthy substitute that's not residing in the boutique price stratosphere.
I suppose, in the end, model features plus my ear must still drive the purchase... as long as I can still gripe about it!

 

[street music]

I don'y understand this move by FENDER , I know cost have gone up on material but 30% is huge in anybody's shop. What I don't like is the fact they raised the stock already in the shops before the increase. I think might hurt them in the future but I still like Fender too.

 

[Bloozcat]

Here is one possible scenario for Fender's recent price hike:

Fender may have been trying to hold a price line for the last several years that was not indefinitely sustainable. Their amps are a combination of US and Ensenada Mexico production. We all know how costly US made products are, but Mexico isn't exactly the lowest of low cost manufacturing countries anymore. Especially the Ensenada plant that Fender has invested much in building, and that boasts a higher level of compensation for it's employees (relatively speaking).

With many companies having profitably shifted amp production to Korea and more so, China, in recent years, Fender may have found themselves at the beginning of 2009 with an impossible situation - trying to compete at retail price points that can't be sustained at the current materials and labor costs of US and Mexican production. Compounding the problem may be a lack of sufficient yearly incrimental price increases to have offset rising production costs. So, Fender may find themselves at a point where they can no longer continue to eat rising costs and they're now raising their prices dramatically just to try to stay alive.

Fender may have decided that the Fender brand recognition and loyalty would be enough to retain customers despite the dramatic price increases. Given today's low price driven market mentality, I'm not so sure that such reasoning would be very sound.

It's just a possible scenario, but with the price increases as sudden and steep as the are, maybe a plausible one...

 

[Rocket]

Many companies are attempting to pad profits by boosting prices, fees, & rates for 2 reasons:
a.) Financial survival: to beat the economic shark attack that will eat marginal companies over the next 10-years it'll take to recover, (regardless of the 1-2 years that we are hearing.)
b.) Confidence: to keep their investors from dumping stock by continuing to post positive earnings with above average profits.

They will do these things in spite of consumer comfort because that's the shark with the smallest bite radius!

 

[wingsdad]

Wingsdad I don't know if I agree with you about resale.

... If we all had '59 Les Paul's at home then they would not be worth far in excess of their MSRP like they are now for example.

You're absolutely correct about rare or vintage guitars, amps & gear, but perhaps I should have qualified my statement about resale values as NOT being in reference to such instruments as a '59 LP. It is indeed a matter of supply & demand of a particular piece.

I was referring to the less remarkable, common pieces, which other than some Fender Limited Edition or Custom Shop models, most MIUSA or MIM Fender & Squier product of the last 10-15 years is just that, and rarely, if ever, will be resold for more than its original MSRP as compared to the current MSRP of the same model ... if it's still produced, the resale value of a common instrument will be generally in the range of what you might be able to buy it for new, today, which is typically a % of the current MSRP, then adjusted slightly up or down dependent on supply & demand in the market it's sold in.

As a starting point, not as gospel, dealers refer to the Blue Books of Electric Guitars and of Acoustic Guitars which show when a model was first & last produced, the last original MSRP and then a range of current values dependent on condition. In the end, even these guides advise that current value will vary from market to market. Consequently they DO check e-bay to get some idea of resale market value, but that, too, is not gospel.

No price guide or e-bay or Christies auction gives any indication of a potential seller's sentiment or emotion entering into the equation.

In the end, a piece is only worth what someone (market or individual) is willing pay for it. One should never underestimate a buyer's emotion. "One man's garbage is another man's gold".

 

[scgmhawk]

Time will tell if this price increase is a good idea or not. I was in a small"ish" guitar shop about a month ago and got to speaking with the owner. I was looking to play a Suhr "Pro Series" at the time. Anyway, he didn't have one in stock and went on to tell me that the only merchandise that he's able to move now is the higher-end stuff. $2500+ guitars and even higher priced amps.

He was also a Reverend ($599) dealer and said he can't move them right now either. It kind of made sense to me. The wealthy are way less affected by the current economy and the rest of us are watching our money much more closely.

I'm not sure if this story has much to do with Fender (after typing it!) but it might? Food for thought if nothing else.

 

[Ch0jin]

Here is one possible scenario for Fender's recent price hike:

Fender may have been trying to hold a price line for the last several years that was not indefinitely sustainable. Their amps are a combination of US and Ensenada Mexico production. We all know how costly US made products are, but Mexico isn't exactly the lowest of low cost manufacturing countries anymore. Especially the Ensenada plant that Fender has invested much in building, and that boasts a higher level of compensation for it's employees (relatively speaking).

With many companies having profitably shifted amp production to Korea and more so, China, in recent years, Fender may have found themselves at the beginning of 2009 with an impossible situation - trying to compete at retail price points that can't be sustained at the current materials and labor costs of US and Mexican production. Compounding the problem may be a lack of sufficient yearly incrimental price increases to have offset rising production costs. So, Fender may find themselves at a point where they can no longer continue to eat rising costs and they're now raising their prices dramatically just to try to stay alive.

Fender may have decided that the Fender brand recognition and loyalty would be enough to retain customers despite the dramatic price increases. Given today's low price driven market mentality, I'm not so sure that such reasoning would be very sound.

It's just a possible scenario, but with the price increases as sudden and steep as the are, maybe a plausible one...

Exactly what I was trying to say

Substitute "American Made" for "Japanese Made" and you've basically explained part of why I am out of a job in 2 weeks.

 

[Ch0jin]

Many companies are attempting to pad profits by boosting prices, fees, & rates for 2 reasons:
a.) Financial survival: to beat the economic shark attack that will eat marginal companies over the next 10-years it'll take to recover, (regardless of the 1-2 years that we are hearing.)
b.) Confidence: to keep their investors from dumping stock by continuing to post positive earnings with above average profits.

They will do these things in spite of consumer comfort because that's the shark with the smallest bite radius!

100% agree except for "above average profits". Plenty of Japanese companies including the one I work(ed) for are posting the first loss's in a long time (in some cases, ever) and price increases and shutdowns are required to promote investor confidence that the company can maintain profit, or in many cases, simply stop the financial bleeding.

 

[BluezOldy]

I don'y understand this move by FENDER ...

It's not just Fender: an Epi LP I priced (street) last December was AU$799, at the end of January/early February it had jumped to AU$1200. The dealer agreed an Epi wasn't worth that and he would never buy one at that price.

Thankfully Tokais are still available at last year's prices.

 

[wingsdad]

Maybe to make more with less?

Here's a thought: maybe the price increases by Fender, et al, are intended to decrease demand. They can save expense by cutting jobs, decrease production & sell less units. And still hit thier profitability target?

I came across this article from August, 2008 while reading on the Rickenbacker forum. Rickenbacker actually raised prices by 20% to decrease demand because they simply can't produce their guitars fast enough -- back ordered for 2 years.

There's a couple of innacuracies in the article, btw: the neck-thru design pertains to solid body models, not the semi-hollows, and the NYC hotel where F.C. Hall presented his guitars to the Beatles was the Plaza, not Savoy.

http://www.seattlepi.com/pop/376154_rickenbacker23.html

 

[sumitomo]

I have a different view of the price of amps,having repaired and built(failed too)some and the price of a D.I.Y. kits.To me it is still priced O.K..Sumi

 

[Robert]

Just buy a Marshall, guys...

 

[Rocket]

Just buy a Marshall, guys...

Aren't you supposed to be pushin' Mack?

 

[Robert]

Just buy a Mack, guys... (I spelled it wrong the first time )

 

[sunvalleylaw]

I thought you were referring to computers for a minute Robert!

 

[oldguy]

I love Fender amps myself. However, when I'm now looking at Super Reverb reissues with a PCB for $1700 versus a hand wired clone of the AB763 circuit for $230 more I think I would consider throwing the small businessman a bone.........providing he can stay in business for the next couple years or so.

I think a lot of the amp builders who are relatively unknown, no matter how good their product, will fold in the next year or so.

 

[Tone2TheBone]

Holy cow I just saw some of the new prices on Fender amps and guitars and I guess I'll keep holding on to my Blues Jr. and my Classic 50s Strat!

 

[sumitomo]

All this talk of the blues jr has given me G.A.S. so I caved in and got a tweed bj with jj's cover and a pedal appears to be low mileage.It's on it's way.Sumi:rockon:

 

[Tone2TheBone]

All this talk of the blues jr has given me G.A.S. so I caved in and got a tweed bj with jj's cover and a pedal appears to be low mileage.It's on it's way.Sumi:rockon:

The BJs are good little Fender amps. They're not Marshalls or bigger Fenders. They're just good little Fender amps. Hopefully you got it cheap cause they're too much now. :AOK:

 

[sunvalleylaw]

Well someday I would love a Bassman. So I guess I would be in for big bucks anyway.